It’s been three weeks or so since the AC joint and supporting ligaments in my left shoulder were completely torn apart.
My recent visit to the orthopedics doc left me kind of annoyed. I waited for about an hour and when the doc finally came in, the first thing he asked me was what I did for a living. I replied with my typical “I’m an IT guy”, to which he replied “Well, you can have surgery, but you’ll be fine without it.”
At that point he was ready to wrap up the visit only 60 seconds in. I asked if the ligaments would ever grow back, and was told they wouldn’t unless I got the surgery. He went on to explain that the muscles in the shoulder would grow to compensate for the lack of support, and unless I was a pro tennis player or something like that, then I shouldn’t worry about it. I asked him if there were any limitations or loss of structural integrity and was told “nothing significant.”
Well I’m sorry, but it seemed to me that a proper shoulder should be supported by the very ligaments I tore. Yes, being an IT guy, the likelihood of me taking up a pro tennis career is practically nil. However, I still felt that any loss of structural support like that couldn’t be good, especially when I get older. After getting my hands on some orthopedics texts while visiting a doctor friend of mine today, I found that indeed a 5% to 10% loss of strength can be expected with a type III separation. What bothers me most isn’t the permanent bump on my left shoulder, or the fact that the ortho doc I saw was basically saying “you’re a fat IT guy, you won’t miss what you don’t use”… what really bothers me is the thought of being broken, especially when I have the option to fix it.
As of today, amazingly I can move my left arm around pretty good and I’m gaining some strength back. I still can’t lift my arm up to raise my hand or anything, and I have no hope of doing things like reaching around to scratch my back. The pain in the AC joint itself is still very real, and it lets me know when I go too far, but all in all I’m impressed with my body’s ability to cope. All the muscles around my scapula still cramp up like nobody’s business, and I have to take frequent rests to help calm those puppies down… but things are progressing.
So with all this progress and not much in the way of lost function to look forward to, why am I considering surgery? Aside from the fixer in me that is bothered as hell that one thing that is supposed to be connected to another just isn’t, and will never be without surgery… the fact is I have an opportunity to take a small risk to fix the problem while I’m young enough to recover as quickly and as thoroughly as possible. No amount of muscle building or physical therapy can get my body to a state as structurally sound as how I’m naturally supposed to be put together.
Still, the argument for just letting it recover without surgery and live with the separated shoulder is a good one, particularly when my physical activity level is currently so low and the foreseeable future doesn’t assume any increase. The real bottom line is; I want my limitations to be entirely of my choosing. I know that sounds kind of funny, but let me explain it this way; When I was a kid growing up, I liked keys. I began collecting them because I knew they would let me into something or somewhere. Eventually that collection became known as “the forbidden key chain”, and held such gems as the mater key to all the doors in my high school, the key to a mountain top communications relay station, and several others. I never used any of these keys… well, ok rarely did I ever use only a couple keys from the forbidden key chain a couple times, but my point is I had the option to use them, but chose not to. The important thing was that I had the choice… and really that’s all anyone wants. I see it all the time.
Let’s say a someone is looking over a clearance table in a local store. They stand and look over the items with other people. As they look over the various things, they are making judgments about usefulness, value, etc. but ultimately nothing from the table interests them. Then this casual browser overhears a couple standing on the other side of the table talking about an item sitting next to the casual browser. Immediately the mind races… the browser instantly becomes an aggressive shopper, rechecking the table, reassessing the item in question. The browser may even be prodded into action by pretending they didn’t hear the couple talking as they pick the item up… staking a claim to it by simply holding it, and at the same time reserving the option, the choice, to purchase it. Whether or not the casual browser decides to buy the item or not is irrelevant. Action was taken because of the pressure generated by the knowledge that soon, if they didn’t act fast, the choice to buy it would be gone. The knowledge that the item itself would be gone is not the affecting issue, the browser had already determined that it was of no interest. Action was taken due to the potential loss of choice.
So here I sit with my broken shoulder. No matter what the doc told me, I know there will be limitations. For example, with my shoulder the way it is I don’t have the choice to take up professional tennis. I know I’ve had and will have a lot more situations come up in my life where I have no choices at all, but in this case I do have one. I can choose to get the surgery.
I’ll give it a month, let things settle down with my shoulder and my day job projects, then I will revisit this decision. Luckily, the doc told me this is a choice that can wait.
Tags: health, psychology
I had exactly the same experience, I’m an IT guy and the doc asked me exactly the same thing “what do you do for a living”… stupid prick.
I haven’t had the surgery. My AC type-3/4 sep happened to me about 1.5 years ago. I can tell you that it gets much better. I don’t have any pain anymore (weird or otherwise), the freakish bump goes almost away. Basically scar tissue forms. I consulted a non-ahole specialist 6 months or so ago and the operation route takes a couple of times in the hospital, low success and long recovery.
My shoulder is not 100%, but only anger at the medical profession remains, (they couldn’t be bothered to schedule physio for me, go get some) Oh, and the specialist said that it was too late for me, but there is a low probability of success procedure for natural reattachment if you do it shortly after the injury… involving an uncomfortable looking pin but at 1 year on for me, there was no point (which pissed me off further).
The longer surgery involves wrapping an extra piece of ligament around like a band-aid and having it replace the AC function.
The only thing I really fear now is flying over the handlebars of my bike on that side but at least I won’t be seperating the AC joint the next time around.
Interesting. Thanks for the comment 🙂
Ah, this is so annoying! I broke my hand at University and it was bound/plastered crooked, so the little-finger-side of my hand has a permanent lump.
“Are you a professional piano player?”, she asked.
“No, but I do play, and I’m a programmer.”
“Well, we could break it and reset it, but you won’t need that.”
Of course: now, after a long hack-session or piano-practise, that precise, precious bone aches. Thanks, doc.
The (“western” — I can’t speak for “eastern” med) medical industry is about “patching”, not “fixing”, the human body. Which makes sense – it grew from battlefield practises aimed at keeping a warrior alive long enough to kill some more enemies!
I don’t distrust doctors; I just don’t think their wisdom limitless, nor even always well-considered.
(Ah, who am I kidding? I don’t trust the shifty little saw-bone buggers!)
I have a type III AC separation, done on March 14th while snowboarding. I am going to my Dr. today, April 8th, for a follow-on appt.
Fred, is your arm 100%? The reason I ask is that I’m in the National Guard and I need to do push-ups and wear very heavy equipment. I would like to know if I will ever be able to do these things without surgery.
Hi Eric,
In Fred’s comment he mentioned “My shoulder is not 100%”, which seems to go with the standard thinking. Every doctor I’ve talked to, plus the medical textbooks I’ve snapped pictures of (see above link), state that you will not, can not return to 100% without reattaching the ligaments. This is because the shoulder is relying completely on your muscles to hold it in place, where before it had lots of help from the AC joint and 3 other supporting ligaments.
If you do get surgery, you MUST remain immobile for 6 weeks. Risk of breaking the support pin and re-tearing the ligaments, causing even more damage. I know I will not be getting the surgery until I have the time to commit to keeping that arm completely still. This includes sleeping all propped up on the couch and not rolling over onto my left side in the middle of the night.
Thanks for the info; I’m going to see my Dr. right now.
Good luck man 😉
I went to the Dr. and he said surgery is not necessary, come back and see me in 6 weeks. I asked him if was O.K. to take my arm out of the sling and move it around and he said sure, the sling was only for comfort.
I also asked him if I should go to physical therapy and he said sure I could do that if I wanted to. I set an appt for 4/17/09. I’m getting the feeling that there is nothing you can do for this injury except wait aroung and let it get back to 80% to 90% on its own.
Does anyone have any better information?
Thanks,
Eric
Yeah, I’m finding that docs are skiddish about doing surgery for this kind of injury because it’s a huge risk compared to the 5%-8% you’ll gain. You’ll never be back to 100%, even with surgery.
So far I’m at a month and a half and I’d say I’m up to about 85%. I still need to stretch to gain back range of motion, and I still occasionally get back cramps if I exhaust myself staying up too late or get tired doing something physical. But, aside from not being able to pick up the heavy lead batteries I used to be able to pick up, or being unable to push up on this heavy hatch cover that leads to the roof of one of the office buildings I work at, I’d say I’m basically recovered at this point.
I’m sure I could do some serious muscle strength training for my left shoulder and back and probably be stronger than I was before, but I still get that uneasy feeling that one day I’ll rip/tear/injure the muscles holding my shoulder in place simply because nothing is attached like it used to be… like it should be.
I’m going to give it a while and really check into surgery to find out if the risk will indeed be worth it. The one thing I will say is you have to commit a full 6 weeks to keeping the arm and shoulder immobile after the surgery. If you stress the pin/screw and break it, your ligaments will re-tear and you’ll have to have surgery just to remove the screw bits and then have another surgery attempt to reinstall it.
Then after everything is healed up, you still need a follow up surgery to remove the screw! It’s a lot to go through for a maximum return of 8%, which is why doctors really don’t want you to take the risk, and they really don’t want to take on the liability.
I just recently experienced a type III separation in my right shoulder two weeks ago. I initially went to an urgency care clinic, spent roughly and hour there, only to finally be seen by the doctor and was promptly sent on to the ER at the hospital.
After that fiasco, once I was seen at the ER, I was given a sling and a prescription for Motrin and Vicodin, then was sent along my merry way. The doctor was supposed to send me a referral for a Orthopedic surgeon, but I guess he never got around to it.
Here I am, two weeks later. I’ve gained about seventy percent of my range of motion back. Strength is gradually increasing as well. There are some funny feelings and a bit of pain, but it’s tolerable. I’ve gradually increased the amount of weight that I carry with it and have begun adding push ups, while on my knees, in an attempt to not let the left side of my upper body atrophy during the healing process.
I’ve done some extensive reading on the injury and it looks like the jury is out in regards to benefits of having surgery. At this point, I’m going to take my chances and let nature run it’s course with my shoulder.
Hmm, you’re doing a lot better at 2 weeks than I was doing. My back was still cramping up fiercely and I was still having a hard time sleeping flat on my back. Unless you are a body builder, I wouldn’t worry too much about atrophy. The fact is, your muscles have to work harder to support your shoulder, that’s why you get cramps. I’m just about at the 2 month mark here and I’m very close to 90%. I can carry a 50lb weight around (haven’t tried more) with my left hand without any indication of weakness on that side. Range of motion is getting much better as well.
Just be careful with those exorcises. Give your body adequate time to heal up properly before pushing it. It’s already working overtime to compensate.
I can tell you, i have a type 3/4 seperation, and i have 100% horsepower in my arm. i have a good sized lump if i let it go, but usually you can’t even tell. i was working hardcore construction in the middle of august a week and a half after the accident. i will admit it took me about three weeks of abusing it to get it back to normal. Once i could move it without feeling knives in my shoulder, i started my own badass therapy- aka, acting like nothing was wrong. it worked for me. Unless your g/f or wife is grossed out by things like the bump then i wouldnt bother with surgery. unless you have no choice whatsoever, you body always ends up worse than before whether it be an ache or chronic pain, especially with bones. trust me, i know. The only thing that sucks is if you are supporting your head or whatever laying on the couch or bed, it can feel wierd and get tired quick because the muscles are doing the work of the ligaments etc. That is the ONLY thing that was changed from before the accident, and the bump.
Thanks for the comment. I’ve come to the point now where my shoulder is probably actually in better shape than it was before the accident because I wasn’t in very good shape before it happened, and now that I’ve been working it I’m actually stronger than before. Of course, it would still be better with the ligaments connected, but at this point it’s not a problem.
I took a long bicycle ride today and did find the left side of my upper back was getting sore and really tired by the end of the ride, but so far I’m very happy with my recovery.
I’m still worried about what will happen when I’m old and my muscles go, but until then I’m pretty sure I’ll be fine.
On the 10th May I had a bad fall off my horse and as a result have a grade 3 fracture of the AC joint, there was talk at the hospital on the day I did it of surgery which terrifies me, I went back to the shoulder specialist 3 days later and he basically gave me no information whatsoever. He told me that I had two options, have surgery (but may not need it straight away) or go away and totally rest it for two weeks (sling on at all times) and if I come back and its starting to heal I start Physio, if its not healing then surgery. I am terrified of surgery and have done lots of research and the research tells me that the surgery is tricky, requires long recovery and can weaken your collar bone and have other complications. I have already broken my right collar bone badly in a fall 6 years ago so now I just look odd on both sides LOL.
I am now back to the hospital in 6 days and have been doing as told and keeping still but I feel I should be doing something to keep the arm moving, how do I know if its getting better? I am pretty strong and have regular comments about how much muscle I have in my arms, deltoids etc so I am hoping that this strength will help my recovery. I too got asked what I did for a living and I too am an ‘I.T. girl’ I think had I said shelf stacker or shot put thrower that they would have just operated straight away but by the sounds of the operation I think I am happy to take my chances as I could potentially be riding and competing again in the next couple of weeks. This thread has given me lots of hope though so thanks 🙂
Hi Sam,
One thing I want to make clear is, your AC joint will never heal. The muscles holding your scapula to your clavical will grow stronger to compensate, but the fiberous disc that makes up your AC joint and the three supporting ligaments that are completely torn in a type III separation will never grow back without surgery. That being said, I’m sitting at 2+ months since my accident and my left shoulder is just as strong now as I was before, if not more so. That’s because I’ve actually been working it out more now than I ever was before the accident. The truth is, my left shoulder will never be as strong as it could be with everything connected like its supposed to be, but for what it’s worth I’m now fine with how my shoulder functions and I will not be getting surgery.
Getting surgery is more risk than it’s worth to me at this point. If I were having ongoing issues with pain or weakness that was limiting my lifestyle in any way, I would opt to get surgery.
All I did to recover for the first month was to move the arm as much as it would let me without severe pain. Keeping it in a sling for me was impractical, so I took a couple weeks off from the office and just worked from home. I just had to move my left arm and hand up to the keyboard using my right hand, but once in position, typing was no issue. I’d dump the sling and use your arm as much as is practical, without pushing it into the pain zone. Pain means you’re going too far 😉
Hi I have an AC III separation (with clavicle fracture) , gotten snowboarding 2005, March.
Currently it still hurts and bothers, but I have managed to continue with life, shoulder is strong but never will be stable like it was.
Now, I have a medical cannabis prescription and I continue to live and I never gave up snowboarding, or martial arts either.
I wont lie though; it still hurts like mofo all the time.
Really? It still hurts? I will admit it twinges from time to time, especially if I sleep on my left side all night, but I wouldn’t categorize it as “hurts”. It sounds to me like you either have a type 4 or 5 where severe complications with the clavicle bone are causing ongoing pain, or somehow you came away with a type 2, where things are tore up but not completely separated, and things are grinding around and/or constantly trying to heal and tearing again and again.
Sorry to hear you are having pain even years after the initial accident. Unless you are thoroughly enjoying your prescription, I’d suggest you go back and get some follow up x-rays to see if surgery or a “tight sling” could heal things up and get rid of the pain.
Hey all, thanks for sharing…thread has been helpful. Im about 2.5 months off of a Grade III separation and Im not limited in most day-to-day activities (parallel parking causes a little pain, or anything that applies pressure to the joint while the arm is stretched out). One thing I can’t do yet without sharp pain is pushups..so i’ve been hesitant to return to lifting/kettlebells/martial arts. I haven’t been doing any serious rehab so maybe I’ll try lighter training first and hopefully that will help it along.
Welcome John 🙂
How’s your mobility? If it’s still limited in some way at this point, I would suggest stretching. Everyone’s body and injury is unique in some way, but since you were already into lifting/kettlebells/martial arts before the accident, I assume your shoulder and back muscles were already pretty strong. They might be holding your shoulder together really well in the absence of the AC joint and supporting ligaments. If the shoulder is held together well, and the separated parts brush and rub against each other, that can cause some sharp pain (from what I hear from the MDs I’ve talked to). Typically, in an effort to protect the joint, things really tighten up after an injury like AC separation and stretching may be in order to help loosen things up a little.
I’ve been doing pushups with no pain from about 1.5 months after the accident. When I started I was significantly weaker on my left side and could only do a few before I had to rest it, but slowly things are getting better/stronger. I never used to stretch much before, but now I give a good stretch out session to both my arms and shoulders in just about every direction at least once a week.
Hi Amal- thanks. Mobility came back fairly quickly and i hav complete ROM now with the caveat of some minor pain when arm is fully stretched out in front of me (esp with some kind of weight or resistance). There is still some “popping” and probably some kind of grinding with some motion, so im not sure if it’s fully there yet. I’ll try stretching more..it has felt “tight” around the joint.
Ive been doing isometric type exercises to strengthen it a little bit..didn’t know if other people recommended or had good experiences with other exercises (my orthopedic surgeon didn’t really give me anything to work with).
Did your doc say anything about damage to your actual rotator (shoulder) joint? Anyway, if you feel like it I’d like an update if the stretching actually helps 😉
I am going to the Dr. in one hour for a follow-up visit where he will tell me there is nothing they can do.
I previously posted I have a Type III while snowboarding on March 14th. I don’t have any pain during normal everyday activities except that once in a while there will be a weird, “tweak” sensation when I move my arm to far in the range of motion.
I have played basketball and ran a 5K last week but I’m hesitant to do pushups or weightligting. I will ask the Dr. if that is a good idea at my appointment today.
Hi Amel,
Thanks for the reply. 3 weeks on and I feel pretty comfortable and pain free. Its sore when I try and pull off clothes (can only wear zip up or button up tops comfortably.) Am now at least able to wash my hair and tie it up… what a pain that was! I am also back to work now. I did ditch the sling, it just wasnt helping. I went back to the specialist last wednesday and they said my movement was good, I have to go back in 6 weeks, they are still not ruling out surgery but I think I am! I am also able to ride my horse again and actually driving my car is more sore than riding (everyone thinks I am crazy!) I just hope that by trying to get back to normal I will get alot of the strength back, and I do hope that taking t-shirts off gets less painful as I dont want to spend all summer in zip up hoodies and button up tops LOL
Thanks again for advise.
Sam
I had a Type III separation three years ago. While the full recovery was long (6 – 12 months?), today I have virtually full mobility. I can do a dozen chin-ups and a dozen dips which are obviously very shoulder intensive. I notice no pain or discomfort. As a slightly overweight 46 year old , I’d say that’s about as close to 100% as can be expected.
I had a type III ac separation back in january was in a sling for about 4 weeks did some PT nothing major mostly stretching with bands and such just recently went back to gym shoulder feels good little weak on free weights but nothing im surprised by what i do think is weird when im laying down relaxed i can actually move my collar bone once i tighten up the muscles it doesnt move besides being kind of gross i am just curious if anyone else has this with there issues i assume since there are no ligaments holding it down may be why it moves i would like to return to snowboarding in the winter but am worried to fall on it again any advice?????
Hmm, interesting. If I lay down with my back to the floor, I can’t push my collar bone “down” to the floor, but it does float a bit which allows me to push it “down” toward my feet a bit. I think this is normal because the collar bone is supposed to pivot with the AC joint to allow a certain amount of movement. With a type III the AC joint and 3 supporting ligaments are all torn out… which is probably why when I lay down and press on it I get a bit of a “broken transmission” feeling in there… like a bunch of torn up stuff crunching around a bit. No pain though, which is good.
I also think about what might happen if I fell on my shoulder again after a type III blowout. My only guess would be that the muscles holding things together might pull or tear… but muscles have a lot more give than ligaments and definitely more than the fibrous disc of the AC joint itself. You’d probably be breaking bones before you’d be tearing apart muscles… but that’s just my layman’s opinion. Not to say you wouldn’t injure those muscles, but tearing them completely is probably not as easy to do as the initial type III separation itself.
Hello:
3 weeks ago I separated my shoulder falling off a MTB. Grade lll. It does not hurt much now and a good ortho Dr. said no to surgery. He is the WMU football doc. So, I guess I just rehab it and live with it? The ligaments NEVER Grow back together? The AC joint just floats out in space within the arm socket and a few muscles hold it in place? Just sounds too easy to say just let it heal. What healing? The ligaments will never grow back, the bump is permanent, what is the healing people are talking about? Please dow anyone have some yes or no answers to these nagging concerns?
Thank you,
Frusterated patient
Hi Mark,
To answer your questions, as best I understand it; No, nothing grows back unless you get surgery and sit still for 6 weeks. The “healing” is actually just scarring of the torn areas and growth of the muscles which holds your scapula to your clavicle. Both of these healing measures are adaptations your body makes to reduce/eliminate pain, and allow you to still function as best you can.
Back in the old days, before an effective surgery was even an option, people tried the “tight splint”, which was a very tightly wrapped splint that forced your arm up into your shoulder. This allowed the ligaments to touch each other and reach out to heal together. The same goes for the AC joint. The only problem was, people had to remain absolutely immobile for 6 weeks or more, and the splint needed adjusting daily to keep it tight. Any movement or slippage of the splint that allowed the arm to fall would re-tear everything. Also, because the splint had to be kept absolutely tight and the patient could not move, bathing was impossible. The tightness of the splint and lack of hygiene contributed to very serious skin problems such as epidermal necrosis.
When the end result of the “healing” process is compared with the options, and the fact that surgery is still risky when 99% of people do fine without it, most doctors do not recommend it (probably because it’s considered elective). If it’s something you want, it is up to you to push for it.
Myself, I’ve resolved to live with it the way it is… at least for now. I do have problems using my arm at full strength though. Over the weekend I found myself having to move 150 pound boxes around and quickly stressed my left shoulder. I definately felt the effects, but I’m still able to get things done just by knowing my limits and staying within them. Meanwhile, I’ll still work on strengthening that shoulder and the muscles that are holding it together. At this point I’m afraid that if I do get the surgery, I’ll just injure it again falling off my bike or whatever, and it will be all for naught. Maybe I’ll consider getting the surgery when I’m 50 and no longer doing the activities that would put me in that kind of position.
Hi folks,
I found this group awhile ago, and I wanted to say I appreciate knowing I’m not alone. I might have the record for rotten timing, though. I blew my shoulder (Type III) in a motorcycle crash on May 22, then rested my arm in a sling until the 25th, when my son was born. I tried to change his diaper with the sling on, gave up and threw the damn thing away. So much for resting the arm.
Same story as everyone else. I’m not an athlete, so surgery isn’t recommended. (I’m a psychologist. Apparently we don’t need arms.) Still, I can’t complain. I landed on my face (full face helmet, fortunately) and shoulder, so a weird feeling shoulder is a hell of a lot better than the other options of death or spinal injury.
A month on, I have almost a full range of movement, but the bump is driving me nuts. Depending on where my arm is, it’s maybe a couple of centimeters over where it should be, and I can feel it moving loosely around in a way a bone just shouldn’t.
Does this feeling go away? I can live with the cosmetic aspects, but the movement is bugging me.
Thanks,
Dave
Hi Dave,
For me, the looseness remains, as I’m sure it does for others. The bones that were tightly held together with taut ligaments and pivoted on the AC joint are now held together with nothing more than muscle and scar tissue. After your back muscles relax a bit from trying to compensate, things just get a bit loose.
I’ve been noticing lately that my shoulder gets a dull sore pain if I push it too hard. As I said in my previous comment, I was moving around 150 pound boxes a couple weeks ago and after 20 minutes of that I had to stop. It took 2 days for the shoulder to recover. I bet if I did some serious physio and built up those muscles it wouldn’t be as severe, but for now I just have to know my limits and stay within them.
Thanks Dave:
It looks like you just live with it and suck it up. I don’t like that option too much, but when I fell off my bike I lost that option now didn’t I?
I will see what happens in the 6th week or so and judge from there. I did find some KINESIO TAPE that is what Keri Walsh was using for the olympic volleyball games. It is a super sticky, very stretchy tape 2″ wide I use and I tape it over my shoulder from the back to front much like where a back back strap would hit you. It makes a HUGE difference!!! I feel more secure (not loose) I have better blood circulation thus aiding the HEALING process and it keeps my “BUMP” down to a minimum.
I got mine from amazon.com for $12 for 5 yards ro so and that is alot relative to how much you use. It stayes on for 3-5 days depending on how often I shower and it just makes the shoulder feel so much more supported or together.
I saw another great video clip on youtube for taping with athletic tape a AC seperation. You go over the shoulder with a few strips, then down the shoulder down the biceped, under the bent elbow and dack up the back side of the arm to the shoulder. Then around the bicep and cut off the remaining tape under the elbow. IT REALLY HELPED as well but it lasts until you shower or one day. It would be great for when you know you are going to stress the shoulder.
But, do yourself a favor and try the Kinesio tape. It is awesome!
Mark
http://www.amazon.com/Kinesio-Tex-Tape-Resistant-Single/dp/B000FOXZI0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1245435675&sr=8-1
Kineseo Tape for better circulation, better support and to help reduce the bump. I use pieces 2″ wide by 8″ long and I have someone stretch it from front to back over my shoulder bump and pull it tight. I do the same thing right beside it goind back to front. Sometimes I put a pieces 4″ long when cutting it, down the shoulder to the arm. Like where a football players jersey has the number.
Get a roll and experiment with where it feels best but it last so long and is cheap compared to big uncomfortable braces that don’t really work.
Mark 🙂
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhjnvDVzios
This is the video of the tape job for a separated shoulder. You can do just the over the shoulder with the kinesio tape to start with.
mark
Nice links!
I separated mine in martial arts on June 6 last year and ended up diagnoses with a type 3 separation two days later at the sports medicine clinic near my house. The orthopaedic surgeon that saw me was a former NFL team doctor and now is a top guy at the local university’s surgery and sports medical clinic. He also asked me how I got it and what I did for a living to gauge whether surgery would be required. He asked specifically if I worked as a carpenter or did continuous over-head lifting. He said for a type three surgery would only be require in maybe 8-10 cases out of 100 that he sees. Most people tend to recover quite well and as was mentioned above the surgery will not necessarily put you much better off. The surgery itself is not too invasive but it will probably take you longer to recover from that than if you do your PT without it, and not really have much to show for it other than a scar. He told me if I was not able to return to my activities, surfing, mountain biking, martial arts, that then to consider surgery or if it gave me problems later in life. This doctor was great and really explained in detail what he thought and why.
My experience with Orthopaedic surgeons prior to that has not been that good on the personal side. I think what some good orthopaedic surgeon’s lack in social skills they make up for with their professional work. The two that I have seen prior to that at the same hospital were both quite cold personally, but fairly attentive.The first I met after shattering my radial head(elbow) and he placed two screws in it. He said, “This is now a perfect radial head” when he put the xray up showing my elbow and two new screws.”But you wouldn’t know what a perfect radial head looks like anyways.” I was taken aback but got over it. So I guess my message is you guys got the standard treatment from your surgeon for the injury. I don’t think they gave you bad advice but they probably did not deliver the diagnosis as well as they should.
Get a good physical therapist and do the therapy everyday. You can recover if you put your mind to it.
Thanks for the input TR. Can I call you TR? 🙂
Hi there everyone
Yep I had a type 3 separation from crashing my dirt bike in an enduro race on the 19April 09 and was also pretty taken back by the whole “let it heal on its own” attitude of the medical profession. The hospital sent me home with pain killers and said “we’ll be in touch by post” What?! I’ve seen the x-ray and I can see the collarbone is nowhere near the place it should be!
So being a bit annoyed by the UK’s Nation Health Service the next day I paid to see a private specialist who treats most of the top bike racers. He explained the injury in detail and he did some magnetic pulse treatment on it and also some laser treatment to get me going again. From walking in with my arm in a sling (in real pain) I walked out without it.
The specialist did say to using it as much as possible to build up the scar tissue so all those of you that are sitting with it in a sling – get it out!
Four weeks later I took part in the next championship race! Everyone thought I was mad to try but I wanted to prove I could still do it and I also had my place in the championship to protect. After two hours racing I took some pain killers to help as the muscles were so sore and tired but carried on for the afternoon session.
It’s now the beginning of July and it’s more or less ok now, but the collarbone does float about and sticks out the top of my shoulder. I have a party trick now and say ‘look here’ then wiggle the bone up and down by pushing on it! Freaks people out no end!
I’ve been very keen to have surgery – but again the doc’s are saying I shouldn’t. Like the other person I’m also worried if I have a big fall on that side again what will happen?
The shoulder muscles get tried much faster on that side and I find that very limiting when racing but the pain of the impacts through the handlebars has just about gone now.
Being a maintenance engineer I can manage ok with it like this but at home in the garden I find when I’m bending over to do some weeding there is a sort of grinding sensation which I don’t like. Cleaning my back in the shower and range of movement is fine now.
So I really need to start working on building up the strength using the home gym – if only I wasn’t so lazy! Oh I’m 45 years old if that makes any difference.
Stage 3 shouder seperation here. Happened while motorcycle road racing in Oklahoma. The absolute worst pain I have ever felt. It happened on May 16th 2009. I saw an ortho doctor who is part of the same group that works on the San Antonio Spurs. I was in a sling for the first 2 weeks. Then I started physical therapy on the third. When I started therapy I barely had any range of motion. I am almost done with therapy. It is now 7 weeks from date of injury and i feel about 95% better. My ROM is almost 100%. My strength is about 75%. Daily I feel a little mild pain but it is improving. My ortho doctor says that I will probably feel pain for another 8 weeks or so.
I too was not confident in my doctors decision to let it heal on its own. I simply did not believe that It could get any better on its own. In fact, I went to another ortho specialist for a second opinion. He told me that he would definately suggest corrective surgery. After asking a few questions I finally asked him if there was a window of time after the injury where you cannot do surgery. He told me that he has done corrective surgery on injuries several years old. He said that he would not recommend waiting if I were older…50’s and up (I am 34). Bottom line is he agreed that I could try Physical Therapy and if it did not work…I could look at surgery in the future. On the positive side, he said that I will never have arthitis on that joint…lol
Bottom line is this. Get a second opinion. If you are trying the non surgical method, definately do Physical Therapy. I don’t beleive I could be where I am at without it.
Hi, names Joe and was told just two hours ago that i had a stage III separation too. Being 20 years old i am very optimistic i will recover soon (haven’t came to grips with reality that this is going to be a while before I’m 100%) I am relieved to see that there a are a lot of people going through the same thing, i haven’t missed a day of work and plan to “will” myself out of this sling in three weeks or less, if there are any excise’s that ant of you found to help it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
p.s cant wait to type with two hands again 🙂
Hi guys….
I took a nasty shoulder fall on the Dirtbike May 16th and now it’s about 7-8 weeks into the injury and finally feeling somewhat normal. The first weeks were incredible pain to even put on a polo shirt and could not touch my face with my left hand. I never got an x-ray after reading surgery is not really required. Not sure if I have a Type 1, 2 or Type 3 or a severe brusing of the bone and AC joint. Anyone have a smooth bump (is it nomally a sharp end of collabone bump?) over the AC joint or a bump which has reduced over time? My collarbone does not move around. I hope its and enflamed AC joint or bone bruise which has not healed yet.
Hi Joe,
Sounds to me like a type III separation. The absence of pain and the persistence of the bump pretty much pegs it to a type III. Did you have back muscle cramping during the healing process? If so, that’s normal as your back muscles are tensing up to try and compensate for the lack of support… however some people have worse cramping than others.
Amal
Had just really severe pain and brusing all down the pec and on the bicep near the armpit. The pain was incredible as you all know. I don’t remember muscle cramping really. I do have some tightening feeling coming right from the AC area right now (like a tight muscle) when I move my arm behind me. Pain is basically gone (just minor soreness) and I can finally sleep on that side. Again Amal, is your bump sharp or just big and round? Can you post a shot? When I first did mine, I really had no obvious bump from all the swelling. As the swelling is reduced now.the bump over the AC and bone is showing up which I hate. I hope we don;t have problems later in life from this!
funny how so many injuries are from the same activities. mine was from snowboarding, went ass over teakettle, landed on the top of my head and left shoulder, and pushed my shoulder “up” towards my lower body. I knew istantly what tore. I never went to a dr. to find out what grade tear I had, but from these posts and the research i did I think it was a grade II. cause it is more than a year out, I don’t have a noticable bump, no real “pain” just lots of moving around and clicking when I do certain movements like putting on my seat belt in my car. I didn’t want to rush into PT too soon, but I am just now up to pushups and weight training. I did have a little pain near my scapula, none now, it mostly seems to move just at the actual joint. I also do a lot of skateboarding which involves throwing my arms up in the air to lift me when doing ollies and such. that is prob. not good for it and might even be tearing it a little and why I am a year out and only feel about 85%. what do yall think?
Hi Allen,
It sounds like you have an odd one. The fact that you don’t have a bump suggests you have a type II where only the AC joint itself is damaged and the ligaments are not torn. Because your ligaments were probably just stressed and not torn, the AC joint does have an opportunity to heal. However, it sounds like maybe the AC joint has a lot of scar tissue and has not been able to heal so now it’s just floating. You might consider a visit to an orthopedic doc to see if staying immobile for 4-6 weeks would repair the damage.
The other possibility is that you do have a type III and your muscle structure is such that you didn’t end up with a noticeable bump. My bump is noticeable, but only if you really look. Where it really becomes obvious is if someone runs their hands down my collar bone, with a bit of pressure, from my neck outward. Then they can really tell the difference between my torn and untorn AC joint. There is an obvious rift where my untorn joint only has a millimeter space between the bones, and my torn joint has a larger space that your finger almost falls into. Check out this post for pictures and x-rays: http://blog.amal.net/?p=323
Hey Joe,
Following up, the bump is what one might call “sharp” in that its less of a bump than it is the end of my collar bone sticking out, and the scapula sitting lower than it should. My right shoulder has a small impression where my AC joint connects my clavicle to my scapula, but the left shoulder has a much larger depression and the scapula sits about 1/2 inch lower than it should, letting the end of the clavicle create the appearance of a bump. In reality it is more like a cliff than a bump… its the absence of my scapula bone just after the clavicle that creates this drop off.
Hi folks,
For what it’s worth, my injury is seven weeks old, and the range of movement is pretty much 100% without load on it. Not so good with weight, but getting there.
For Joe, my collarbone sticks out as a smooth bump, pretty obviously a rounded bone tenting the skin. Annoying as all hell, and it hurts worse when I can see it, which kind of suggests a lot of psychological features.
For joe, as for willing yourself out of the sling in three weeks, you might as well toss it now. I got five days in my sling before I had to change and carry a new baby, and you really are better off building up the scar tissue as much as you can stand it. I managed to get into the office of a good orthopedic surgeon, and he said what they all say: you can’t do any more damage, the AC joint is gone. And at least you won’t get arthritis there. I guess that’s maybe an orthopedic joke of some kind, even if it is accurate.
On another issue, did you all go back to riding? I wrote my bike off (W650 and hard to replace, which annoyed me) and my son is scared of me riding again.
Thanks again for the support.
Hi Dave,
I’ve got back on my GSX1300R ‘Busa a couple weeks ago. Promptly got a speeding ticket for going 69MPH in a 50MHP zone. Thank god he didn’t catch me when I was going 113MPH! Anyway, I’m getting rid of the bike because I just can’t seem to ride it at the speed limit 🙂
While on the bike I had no pain at all, and the only time I recognize I have a bum shoulder is when I’m lifting weight above my head, or sleeping on that shoulder… but in both cases I only have a slight discomfort, not what I would call “pain”.
Thanks Dave. I’m on 8 weeks now and still have this really stiff feeling (right at the AC joint) like the shoulder needs to stretch or something all the time and it’s worse when my arm goes slightly behind me (with hand at my side). I hate this feeling like the joint will not “stretch” out. Feels tight. Not pain but tight feeling. Hope this goes away…why does it feel stiff?
How many of you guys look like this guy?
http://www.uptodate.com/patients/content/image.do;jsessionid=F70A4C735C235A2324A80FFC7A8C54D4.1105?imageKey=emer_pix/ac_typ2.htm&title=AC%20type%20III%20photo
I’m at about half that severe looking… but then again I’m probably half his age too.